Rules are things you apply to other – lesser – people

Stalwart of The Pub, Aguirre, today ‘penned’ yet another of his exquisitely insightful comments. It was greeted with much acclaim, as post of the week, and I agree. So – with our guest author’s kind permission, the comment now morphs into our latest threadstarter. Thank you so much, Aguirre!

Photo credit: Alamy Stock Images

Looking around the discussion regarding MPs and citizenship, it seems to me a lot of people out there are still missing the point. It’s not really about how this government can or cannot hang on to power, or about whether the constitutional rules are arcane, or even about the timing of renunciations. It’s about something a lot larger than that, and something that strikes at the heart of everyone’s lived political experience.

It’s about short-cuts, privilege, and the idea within right-wing circles that rules are things you apply to other people. I think we’ve seen enough to know that a lot of MPs were aware all along that they had citizenship issues – they just didn’t care because they thought it would never come up. The key to this is that that is their attitude to everything. You do as little as you need in order to become an MP – that includes not only just ticking boxes on a form whether or not you’ve done your due diligence on them – but also trotting out whatever empty promises get you across the line, only considering what’s strategically effective as a message and not what’s practically effective as a policy, and just generally riding in on a tide of slurs, lies, and slogans. As a party, the Liberals also have that attitude to expense claims. Take, take, take, and justify later on – when and if necessary. It’s what got Bronwyn Bishop kicked out of her job.

Coalition MPs simply aren’t across the details on anything. They think things will work out in the end, but at that level they simply don’t. They spent a lot of time in opposition focusing on minor details, which gave the impression that they were into fine print, But that was just concentrating on gotchas, and even most of those were based on shonky information or misconstruing data – think of any of Hockey’s presentations as Shadow Treasurer: they were all based on distorted information made to look like real research.

What we’re seeing at the moment is a bizarre manifestation of that general laxity of discipline and accountability. It’s the same attitude that brought us the Census, the NBN, all of our policy-on-the-run asylum seeker bastardry, Robodebt, and pretty much everything they’ve touched since gaining power in 2013. Even their Royal Commissions were half-hearted and shoddily researched. Their Productivity Commission reports were constructed around … you couldn’t even call it ideology: mere assumptions, as was more or less admitted in the aftermath. Robodebt is almost the textbook case for their double-standard on accountability. Welfare recipients are held to the strictest standards based on data that’s wildly inaccurate, and designed to be that way. It was a rush job treated as a kind of economic gospel, and of course it ran into problems at once. The recent raid on the AWU is another good example of the Liberals’ holding somebody else to strict standards – an internal procedural issue from a decade ago? – while leaving themselves wide open to attack because their own organisation of the raid was so cack-handed. In fact, this pattern goes all the way back to Utegate.

And that’s what the citizenship mess is telling us. These guys don’t check anything beforehand. They guess at things, expect it all to go swimmingly because they’re Important People, and only energise themselves when it’s time to organise a cover-up to save their arses.

960 thoughts on “Rules are things you apply to other – lesser – people

  1. Also Tony Abbott’s father died today. May he rest in peace and my sympathies to Tony and Christine.

    I know I said very nasty things about Abbott in the past but I will not today.

  2. This should be bought up come the next election again and again.

    “You talk about a whole lot of things when you’re trying to convince people to do things,” she says. “But you don’t go back and honour every single one of those unless you have made a firm commitment about it and John wasn’t into making firm commitments.”

    Janet (I am entitled) Howard

    • Seems to me like Janet was a bit pee’d off at John for not giving her a “firm commitment” for quite some time up to the utterance of that comment.

  3. Well, my grammar may have been off, but I just had to remark on that Bolt article for 2 reasons.

    A) Bolt acknowledges Abbott’s downfall with the Australian electorate happened mostly from his own doing, not through treasonous betrayal.

    And B) He’s actually stating sound political facts (for these modern times) that unpopular politicians that break promises fall very fast, and that Shorten should be wary of that.

    Yes I know with someone like Bolt there’s probably an ulterior motive against Labor and progressives in his writing this, but, perhaps there’s a little hope deep down that this might be a turning point for the Conservatives in the press to stop defending the Coalition to the hilt and acknowledge that Labor will probably be the next government.

    • Bolt is just fed up with turnbull & Co killing off all chance of a Coalition government being re-elected.

      There is an ulterior motive. He wants a change of PM,, he wants Turnbull gone. It was Bolt who broke the story about a government MP being ready to turn indie if Turnbull remains leader. (That story also reported on Julie Bishop’s unpopularity within the government ranks.)

      If Bolt is talking about the reasons for Abbott’s downfall then it’s because he doesn’t want Abbott, or any other replacement for Turnbull doing the same things again.

  4. Okay, I’ve had enough. I’d like to ask a question.

    How exactly can we as Australians help those on Manus? I honestly don’t know what there is that can be done.

    Personally I’d be delighted if Jacinda Adern engages some gunboat diplomacy and sends the NZ Navy in to forcibly pick them up, but, of course that can’t be a realistic option (or if it does end up being so it’d pretty much throw everything up in the air).

    Those on Manus have suffered enough, they don’t deserve this shit, but, what physically can be done with this government in executive control and is fully prepared to let them all die if it means vindication in their marginal electorates?

  5. KK I haven’t received any email from you with your name & address so I can send you the AC/DC photos.
    Not sure which email Fiona supplied, make sure you don’t have an “o” on the end of my email name

  6. Damn. I guess all I can hope from this is an end result where this government faces a royal commission with stakes as high as the Nuremberg trials.

    With the key difference of the death penalty (obviously, since that’s abolished), I’d rather those responsible not be killed but instead live through some kind of punishment.

    And if Labor individuals get caught up in it, so be it, if they acted against international law too then they would not be above punishment.

    • For that matter, the Greens who colluded with the then Opposition and voted down the Malaysian amendments should also be tried as accessories before the fact (at the very least).

  7. http://www.ntnews.com.au/news/national/queensland-election-2017-galaxy-poll-predicts-win-for-labor-and-premier-annastacia-palaszczuk/news-story/4c4804fed34f6c180ae3a64d9e506c7d paywalled, google the URL. NT News came up in my google search, but its in the CM proper too. More in the article on regional differences in results apart from what I’ve copied below.

    Queensland Election 2017: Galaxy poll predicts win for Labor and Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk
    Steven Wardill, The Courier-Mail
    in 2 hours
    Subscriber only

    ANNASTACIA Palaszczuk is on the cusp of leading Labor to a historic election victory on Saturday, despite a deep chasm in voter sentiment that has divided Queensland.

    An exclusive Courier-Mail/Galaxy poll has revealed the Queensland Premier is poised to pick up enough southeast corner seats to replace losses in the regions where voters have turned against both major parties.

    Labor could snare the 47 electorates necessary to form a majority in the 93-seat State Parliament, with a win furthering Ms Palaszczuk’s record as the most successful female major party leader in Australian political history.

    However, the result hinges heavily on the unpredictable preference flows from One Nation supporters after Labor controversially ditched Queensland’s “Just Vote 1” laws.

    The poll of more than 1500 Queenslanders conducted this week found Labor leads the LNP 52 per cent to 48 per cent on a two-party preferred basis, the same result that was recorded in the days after Ms Palaszczuk pulled the trigger on the early election.

    One Nation’s vote has sunk from 18 per cent to 12 per cent statewide after Pauline Hanson’s gaffe-prone campaign that was repeatedly interrupted, where the party only managed to field candidates in 61 electorates.

    This has allowed Labor’s vote to inch forward over the past four weeks from 35 per cent to 37 per cent, almost mirroring the support Ms Palaszczuk received at her extraordinary 2015 victory over Campbell Newman.

    The LNP has also benefited, increasing from 32 per cent to 35 per cent, although this figure is well below the 41.3 per cent achieved three years ago.

    However, the more telling results are revealed in the divergence in voting patterns between the southeast corner, where there are 62 electorates, compared to the rest of the state, which has 31 seats.

    • FFS! Why?

      TAFE colleges are being closed across the state to save money. Public housing is being handed over to private providers to save money. And yet the state has plenty of cash to throw away on renovating stadiums?

      Gees, Gladys, what on earth are you thinking? Do you think at all?

  8. Good morning Dawn Patrollers.

    John Hewson reckons Turnbull’s only salvation will be tax reform.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/malcolm-turnbulls-only-salvation-is-true-tax-reform-20171123-gzr6zq.html
    Mark Kenny reports on yet another derailment for Turnbull. He must be getting very close to earning “embattled” status!
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/malcolm-turnbull-derailed-by-cabinet-leaks-and-nationals-rebellion-over-banks-20171123-gzrgsb.html
    And he tells about the leak.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-opinion/trust-deficit-cabinet-leaks-and-poor-polls-see-risks-multiply-20171123-gzr9ip.html
    Michelle Grattan says that discovering the identity of the cabinet leaker would present a bibber problem than the leak itself! What was Bishop thinking she asks?
    https://theconversation.com/grattan-on-friday-discovery-of-the-cabinet-leaker-would-present-bigger-problem-than-the-leak-88030
    Waleed Aly says that the same-sex marriage debate could yet claim Malcolm Turnbull as a victim. He concludes with “What we’re seeing is the concept of religious freedom being invoked promiscuously, and then weaponised. Ultimately it won’t succeed. But there’s every chance in the meantime it will claim Turnbull as collateral damage.”
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/samesex-marriage-debate-could-yet-claim-malcolm-turnbull-as-a-victim-20171122-gzqukw.html
    David Wroe writes about the Foreign Affairs With Paper and reaction to it.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hardheaded-foreign-affairs-blueprint-praised-as-us-bombers-set-to-arrive-in-australia-20171123-gzrqsm.html
    China’s not impressed with it though.
    http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-white-paper-irresponsible-says-chinese-foreign-ministry-20171123-gzretp.html
    The SMH editorial has its say about the white paper.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/smh-editorial/white-paper-catches-the-chill-in-the-air-20171123-gzrlny.html
    Peter Martin tells us how some of Australia’s most powerful corporate leaders have called on the country’s $2 trillion superannuation industry to become a major source of lending for local businesses in a move aimed at bypassing banks and stimulating investment.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/rinehart-pratt-and-fox-spearhead-push-for-super-funds-to-directly-fund-business-20171123-gzrijt.html
    LNP senator Barry O’Sullivan will attempt to have MPs cross the floor to support a probe into financial services. Google.
    /national-affairs/rogue-lnp-senator-barry-osullivan-to-lob-bombshell-banking-inquiry-bill/news-story/f9f88fddb48449d116c5235e41f8cd0a

  9. Section 2 . . .

    Ken Henry has issued an extraordinary attack on the RBA’s framework for setting rates. Google.
    /business/financial-services/competitive-advantage-forum-rba-slated-over-rates-as-big-banks-sound-alarm/news-story/ae14585be1b7feb49f27ed1e1c15d258
    On the NT royal commission this human rights fellow says time is running out for Turnbull on youth justice.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/nt-royal-commission-time-has-run-out-for-malcolm-turnbull-on-youth-justice-20171121-gzpvq0.html
    Bennelong by the numbers: The voters who could decide Malcolm Turnbull’s fate.
    http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/national/2017/11/23/bennelong-byelection-electorate-preview/
    Public service heads have pledged to confront domestic violence.
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/public-service-leaders-pledge-to-confront-domestic-violence-and-do-more-to-help-victims-20171122-gzqqnp.html
    Two psychologists reveal that the catastrophic effect of the postal vote process on the LGBTQIA+ community has been well documented, with a sharp increase in demand for mental health services within the community during that process. The battle has just started they say.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/yes-the-right-campaign-won-but-its-only-the-start-of-the-battle-for-equality-20171122-gzr5ci.html
    Dennis Shanahan writes that John Howard has debunked ¬Malcolm Turnbull’s argument that religious freedoms will lead to sharia law in Australia and ¬declared he fears the fight for protections in the same-sex marriage debate will “die in the sand”. Google.
    /national-affairs/howard-tackles-turnbull-on-religious-freedoms-after-marriage-vote/news-story/a59b42bff5a929ceac993bc6e372e867
    Meanwhile Labor has rejected demands for amendments to the cross-party same-sex marriage bill, with Mark Dreyfus saying the bill is already a compromise and Louise Pratt warning MPs on both sides to respect the postal survey result.
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/nov/23/labor-rejects-coalition-conservatives-changes-to-same-sex-marriage-bill
    The world’s largest lithium-ion battery, which is being built in South Australia by Tesla to store renewable energy, is about to enter final testing. Jay Weatherill said Elon Musk’s Tesla company had finished installing the battery powerpacks at Jamestown, in the state’s mid-north, where they are linked to an adjacent windfarm. He said the 100-megawatt battery will now be energised and tested to ensure it meets all energy market and state government regulatory requirements.
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/nov/23/elon-musks-tesla-battery-in-south-australia-poised-for-final-testing
    Barnaby Joyce clearly talks the agriculture talk and walks the mining walk as he receives the inaugural Gina Rinehart prize for even worse judgement than Turnbull, writes Ingrid Matthews.
    https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/barnaby-joyce-receives-rinehart-prize-for-even-worse-judgement-than-turnbull,10959
    Madonna King gives us the tale of two Queenslands – and One Nation.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/that-thinking-feeling/a-tale-of-two-queenslands–and-of-one-nation-20171122-gzr53i.html

  10. Section 3 . . .

    The Guardian in the UK is pissed off that despite having given Teresa May clear evidence of rampant tax avoidance she still hasn’t acted.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/nov/23/theresa-may-government-tax-avoidance-paradise-papers-inquiry
    A dishonest culture still runs deep at Uber.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/travis-kalanick-has-gone-but-a-dishonest-culture-still-runs-deep-at-uber-20171122-gzr2kp.html
    Adam Gartrell tell us how the High Court has both the “power and duty” to rule on a challenge that could disqualify a Turnbull government minister – further threatening the Coalition’s tenuous grip on power – even though the case was brought by a private citizen rather than referred by Parliament.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/high-court-has-power-and-duty-to-hear-challenge-against-turnbull-government-mp-david-gillespie-20171123-gzrfnw.html
    Climate change is creating a disaster on Australia’s doorstep, with environmental degradation and the demand for sustainable sources of food undermining stability in some countries, especially “fragile states”, according to the Australian government’s first foreign policy white paper in more than a decade. Hang on!
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/nov/23/australia-facing-climate-disaster-on-its-doorstep-governments-white-paper-warns
    Liberal Party officials in SA have cleared Christopher Pyne of any misconduct before the 2013 election. That won’t please Bernardi. Google.
    /national-affairs/christopher-pyne-cleared-of-faction-claim/news-story/ccc920c8e0595fc80961c574bd94862c
    Turnbull has declared he “won’t be pressured” by the ongoing standoff on Manus Island after a seismic day in which police stormed the camp, destroyed property and appeared to make an arrest.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/we-will-not-be-pressured-malcolm-turnbull-warns-manus-island-refugees-after-clashes-with-police-20171123-gzr6wn.html
    The Department of Social Services has written to 8,500 current and former employees warning them their personal data held by a contractor has been breached. Under this government Centrelink has really covered itself with glory!
    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/nov/24/data-breach-hits-department-of-social-services-credit-card-system
    Woolworths will open as many as four new so-called “dark stores” used to pack and ship online orders by the end of next year as Australia’s largest supermarket prepares to defend itself from Amazon.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail/woolworths-to-open-four-new-dark-stores-to-fight-amazon-20171122-gzr3tg.html
    And in a move to counter the imminent launch of Amazon Bunnings Warehouse has unveiled plans to allow customers to shop online, ending a long-standing strategy of only selling products in its stores. But it’s quite a limited offering by the look of it.
    http://thenewdaily.com.au/money/finance-news/2017/11/23/bunnings-online-shopping-plans-amazon/

  11. Section 4 . . . with Cartoon Corner Part 1

    Two of Sydney’s major sports stadiums will be demolished and rebuilt at a cost of $2 billion after state cabinet signed off on an expensive conclusion to the long-running saga on Thursday. But this is only the beginning it seems.
    http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/stadium-bill-to-soar-above-2b-following-cabinet-approval-20171123-gzrbjj.html
    On this subject Clover Moore explain how power works in NSW.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/this-is-how-power-works-in-nsw-20171123-gzrehe.html

    David Rowe goes to Moby Dick to show the government’s woes. Who is the seal representing I wonder?

    A disgusted David Pope has his say about Manus Island.
    http://www.smh.com.au/photogallery/federal-politics/cartoons/david-pope-20120214-1t3j0
    Matt Golding and the cabinet leek.

    Two more from Golding.
    https://t.co/QZN7PJVWNB

    John Shakespeare intimates that Turnbull’s done.

    Matt Davidson uses AC/DC to give Turnbull a reminder.
    http://www.smh.com.au/photogallery/federal-politics/cartoons/illustrations-by-matthew-davidson-20090928-g8gc.html
    Paul Zanetti and assisted dying of another sort.

  12. Section 5 . . . Cartoon Corner Part 2

    Mark Knight and some welcome triumphalism.

    Glen Le Lievre with a beauty,

    Another from Le Lievre where he suggests it’s over for Turnbull.

    What a cracker for Alan Moir. And how true!

    Another Beauty from Moir.

    Jon Kudelka and more cabinet leaks.
    http://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/577efe6efc4259636d49b8b02dbebcca
    Simon Letch and the religious right. Quite telling!

  13. Turnbull’s ’embattled’ status –

    He hit ’embattled’ status almost a year ago, back in January, with this headline –
    Expenses scandal an embarrassing start to 2017 for Australia’s embattled PM
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-australia-politics/expenses-scandal-an-embarrassing-start-to-2017-for-australias-embattled-pm-idUSKBN14T05L

    Since then there have been many sightings of the ‘e’ word but since the end of October things have really escalated.

  14. Behrouz is tweeting comments about the situation on Manus, right now. Twitter users might like to take a look.

    From vile comments I’ve seen on Facebook under articles on Manus posted by SBS, Dutton’s hate campaign is working. I think these people are trolls, going by the things they say, they seem to be copying Dutton’s comments. I doubt any of them would ever go anywhere near SBS unless they were told to make revolting online comments. None of them are commenting on the many posts by refugee organisations like ASRC and Dassan though, which tells me there is an orchestrated hate campaign aimed at SBS underway. Would Hanson know anything about that, I wonder?

  15. Bill Shorten is campaigning in Bennelong today with Tanya Plibersek and Doug Cameron, all there to support Kristina Keneally. Bill has been there with Kristina since they announced she would be the candidate. Labor is throwing everything at this by-election.

    Turnbull has not been near Bennelong.
    The Oz is talking about now that other by-election that finished off a PM.

    A by-election finished off last leader, remember?
    SIMON BENSON

    Malcolm Turnbull has entered the danger zone, with every utterance from cabinet colleagues being viewed through a prism of leadership and positioning.

    This is unsustainable and almost impossible to reverse for a leader whose authority is being openly challenged.

    The risk for the Prime Minister is that if this is allowed to become the prevailing perception it can have only one outcome.

    Julie Bishop’s intervention yesterday into supposed cabinet leaks — denying she was a leak and calling for an inquiry — was almost without precedent for a deputy leader. It was bizarre and rightly observed by colleagues as deliberate posturing. The insinuation was that Turnbull has lost control of his cabinet.

    The apparent schism between Peter Dutton and Scott Morrison over religious protections has been no less subtle. The feud over same-sex marriage and the apparent divisions within cabinet over the threat of a banking inquiry have now become the proxy wars for the leadership.

    There are those in cabinet and the broader ministry who have come to their own individual conclusions that it’s over for Turnbull.

    There is no collusion or conspiracy, no fix on numbers and certainly no assigned candidate, despite red herring tickets being floated, such as a Bishop-Morrison combination (which wrongly assumes Morrison would be interested in being a deputy).

    There is now a more serious tone to the chatter that began two weeks ago. The view among the senior ranks of government is that the Bennelong by-election could become the catalyst.

    In the unlikely, but possible, event that the seat is lost, Turnbull’s survival becomes deeply questionable.

    Even so, with only one party room meeting left this year — the week before the by-election — the likelihood is Turnbull’s leadership woes will remain confined to chatter until at least the new year and until the citizenship crisis is resolved.

    This means the government will continue to bumble along, with little prospect of clean air to resurrect an agenda let alone prosecute it with any effect.

    “It’s stating the obvious but unless he can turn things around, you’d have to say it’s over,” another senior minister told The Australian.

    “Bennelong is becoming increasingly likely to become a trigger if we lose it, or even if there is a swing of even 8 or 9 per cent.”

    The irony would not be lost on Tony Abbott, who was toppled as leader the week of the Canning by-election.

    Any objective assessment of the situation, considering the febrile nature of the party room, can only conclude that there are a growing number of MPs and senators who have given up on Turnbull but perhaps an equal number who hold out hope that things will change.

    What will determine Turnbull’s survivability will ultimately come down to whether a left-wing Liberal leader can win seats in NSW and Queensland — rather than lose them — and not his failure to live up to the metrics he set for his own leadership.

    It would be naive to suggest any Coalition member would willingly go into opposition in the belief it was more noble or virtuous than changing leader

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/a-byelection-finished-off-last-leader-remember/news-story/e2f6e8d38b50f10f0b1a425f4958998d

  16. Barnaby has a big sook about the way we are mean to his beloved Gina.

    He doesn’t seem to understand that paying tax is not making a ‘donation’ and not even Gina can specify where her tax is allocated.

    Barnaby Joyce: treatment of Gina Rinehart “disgusting”

    But I just want to say this, when an individual, who is on the public record, pays half a billion (dollars) in tax donation, to pay for the hospitals, to pay for the schools, to pay for the defence force – then what our nation needs is 20 of them

    http://www.farmonline.com.au/story/5074295/barnaby-joyce-treatment-of-gina-rinehart-disgusting/

  17. Would be no different here 😦 Especially with a PM who has parked his money in a places known as a “notorious tax haven”.
    .
    “We gave May clear evidence of tax avoidance. Why won’t she act?
    Nick Hopkins
    The Paradise Papers revealed immoral and unfair practice on an industrial scale – yet ministers seem reluctant to have a parliamentary or public inquiry”
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/nov/23/theresa-may-government-tax-avoidance-paradise-papers-inquiry

    • Just take a close gander

      Federal Human Services Minister Alan Tudge told reporters in Melbourne on Friday that most cases were uncovered within a few weeks of the prisoners being locked up.

      “In most cases we uncover those cases in a couple of weeks (of the prisoner being locked up), but in some cases it can take longer.

      “We are increasing the sophistication of our data matching in order to stay in front of the criminals who go to extraordinary lengths to get around the system,” Mr Tudge said.

      The government says it now matches Centrelink records with inmates around the nation to quickly cut off scheduled payments.

      In some cases prisoners are rorting the system by using fake names and changing their birthdate, Mr Tudge said, which can take longer to detect.

      “My message to those prisoners is, we will find you and you will have to pay the debt back and you may well end up in prison a lot longer.”

      http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/national/2017/11/24/federal-government-crackdown-prisoners-rorting-centrelink-16-5-million-dodgy-claims/

      Equivalent to : “How were we to know this is happening?”

    • I posted before I read it.
      Yep Tudge is shaming and blaming the lowest in society
      A friend did the analysis and design of the prison systems length of imprisonment after successfully completing a hotel billing system. He noted that 75% of prisoners in Victoria were there for non payment of fines ie they were poor
      I think downward envy is a bad look

  18. “support you local LNP, One Nat—–”

    Listening to the clip, the comma in the transcript is being too generous.

    Should have been a “/”.

  19. This is what they are all saying

    The Ashes: Australia battles back in final session to leave first Test delicately balanced after day two

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-11-24/test-delicately-poised-with-smith-marsh-rescuing-aussies/9190328

    Australia 137 behind with six wickets in hand.

    The pitch is starting to play a few tricks and it would be hard to get 200 on the last day. They need to be 100 + in front when England starts batting again.

  20. I keep seeing people popping up on my Twitter feed saying that because the ALP haven’t done enough to protest Manus, they won’t vote ALP next election. Not trolly types either, I recognise the names.

    What on earth do they think will happen if they vote against the ALP? By which I assume they mean they won’t preference them. It would mean they prefer outright evil to bouts of moderate badness. Or that they simply can’t see the difference. I tell you, people are stupid.

    We had all this moronic self-sabotage in the US election last year, where Sanders spruikers refused to vote for Clinton. They got Trump, and an inner glow because they wouldn’t compromise. Which means bugger all when your country is on a road straight to hell.

    I say be as disappointed as you like, if that’s your thing. But don’t let it cloud your better judgement, if you have any.

    • I’d probably recognise a few of those names too. I got fed up with certain persons ages ago because they were always whining about Shorten, saying they couldn’t vote Labor while he was leader, Labor ignored the will of the members and so on. This sort of thing was repeated so often by the same suspects that I started to think they were actually Liberal Party plants and I’m pretty sure none of them were ALP members.

      Now it’s refugees.

      What is Labor supposed to do? Labor is just as powerless to act as we are. Only the government can send aid to Manus, or agree to accept New Zealand’s offer of resettlement. The miserable bastards won’t.

      The complainers don’t seem to have noticed Shorten writing letters to Turnbull asking him to accept Jacinda Adern’s offer. Too busy tweeting their faux outrage and attention-seeking tantrums to know what is happening outside their narrow little focus, i think.

      Ages ago, after someone who seems to live on Twitter 24/7 said something incredibly stupid a response was fired back – something like “Too much tweeting, not enough real world”. I think a lot of tweeters should get a life. And grow a brain.

    • I’m not sure what thread’s what at the moment, so at risk of this being made redundant, I’ll just reply here instead of cutting and pasting it elsewhere.

      I think they’re mostly Greens, who see an opportunity of hacking into the ALP voter base. That’s mostly what Greens do nowadays as far as I can see. The spirit of cooperation has long since left them, maybe due to disillusionment with politics in general, maybe because they really do think the party can land 25 seats. It’s delusional stuff either way.

      Once you abandon the instinct toward outcomes, and retreat to party identification, you’re really of no use to anyone. That’s particularly relevant to minor parties, who can only do good in league with one or other of the majors. Greens voters might not like that, but that’s the way it is. Just figure out which major party is the one closest to doing good, and try to work with them. That’s all there is to it. If you want to chase votes instead, well, the country goes completely to seed in the interim between now and your guys actually being a major player, which could take anything from 20 years to forever. We don’t have that time available. Things have to be done now.

  21. Dutton was at it again yesterday. When something on Manus happens that he thinks can be used against those detained there he gets himself on TV and says things “People have been sabotaging infrastructure at the new accommodation in Lorengau Town.”

    He is, of course, inferring that the ‘sabotage’ was done by detainee’s that have been moved out of the detention centre at the PNG Navy base.

    Yesterday’s effort was in regard to a generator at one the three new accommodation blocks in Lorengau that he insists are ready to accommodate the remaining detainees. The UNHCR says the new blocks have some way to go before they’re are completed.

    It was reasonably well reported that the generator was turned off by a local who lives in close proximity to one of the new blocks and had complained to local officials a number of times about the noise of the generator without any action being taken. The local mans problem was that the generator had been running for three days without a muffler keeping his children awake.

    The ‘sabotage’ consisted of the local switching the generator off and taking the keys to it.

    Dutton has used the ‘people’ line before. You might recall that there was video of toilet/shower blocks with some broken toilet bowls and other things released the day after the water and power was cut off to the compound.

    I understand that this video was taken in a block outside the fence and the toilet/showers facilities were provided for guards working there. At least one local with his face ‘blurred’ was on TV last week saying that he hoped to ‘source’ a toilet bowl, a toilet cistern, a shower base and, if possible, some matching shower screens from the guards change block when the guards left.

    The video taken showed a couple of broken toilet bowls. Anyone who has had a plumber in to ‘chip’ a toilet bowl out of a tiled floor because they can’t get a blocked drain cleared without demount the toilet will know that plumbers generally tell you that it takes quite a bit of patience to get one out without breaking it and you should be ready to have to buy a new one if it breaks.

    • Dutton also told Ray Hadley that refugees on Manus had been enjoying the services of personal butlers and cleaning maids ‘for years’. Maybe he was trying to be funny, in the same way he was ‘just joking’ when he didn’t know the microphone was one and was caught talking about Pacific islands and said “Time doesn’t mean anything when you are about to have water lapping at your door”. Ha ha! Very funny. Dutton should give up the attempts at humour, he’s abysmal at trying to be funny.

      In the same interview Dutton said the refugees were living in squalor, which meant those cleaners and butlers we allegedly paid for must have been very slack workers. Did anyone question these comments? Of course not. Ray Hadley is there as a cheerleader for the government, not as a critic.

      The squalor was because he had ordered the turning off of the water and power, and had also cut food supplies. The place was trashed by the PNG police.

  22. Something I found interesting about the QLD state election is that pre-poll voting is actively encouraged:
    “You’re welcome to vote early – no special reason needed!” Eureka!

    The drive-through polling booth was a gimmick too far… but if it encourages people to vote instead of copping the fine, that’s a good thing. (I’ll be very interested in the participation rate statistics.)

    Having gone to the trouble of setting up pre-poll voting stations weeks prior to the election, why do you need a reason to use them?! I’m here, you’re here, I want to vote… and … I’m “traveling interstate”. (On the bright side, I don’t think I was asked for a reason last time.)

    AFAICT, the only reason for being forced to vote on the day is to maximise the number of votes counted on the night, and possibly get a quicker result. Sod that!

    Get rid of the hours of drudgery standing in line (rain, hail, or sunburn) while getting strafed by how-to-vote card pushers, and replace it with easy voting – and days of post-election drama as the pre-poll and postal votes trickle in. Embrace it! Exploit it! “The Block” does: 10 minutes of content stretched out to an hour.

  23. Good morning Dawn Patrollers.

    James Massola on Morrison’s last ditch fight to prevent a banking RC or inquiry. He doesn’t think it will work.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/scott-morrison-working-on-last-resort-compensation-scheme-for-bank-victims-20171124-gzs9kd.html
    Meanwhile new laws holding bank executives to greater account for scandals and misconduct should be broadened to cover other financial services operators, as well as to conduct causing harm to consumers, a senate committee has urged.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/banking-and-finance/new-bank-accountability-laws-should-be-extended-inquiry-20171124-gzs1ne.html
    Paul Bongiorno says the Turnbull government’s overdraft with the Australian electorate is well and truly spent. Bill Shorten and the Labor Party are a model of stability by comparison.
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/opinion/topic/2017/11/25/queensland-mps-threaten-revolt/15115284005537
    Paul Kelly says the Liberal Party has no alternative leader and no alternative strategy. It risks a lose-lose future. Google.
    /opinion/columnists/paul-kelly/coalition-sinks-deeper-into-the-valley-of-despair/news-story/1ef632cb697fc53240a8e9487ea155fb
    The Turnbull Government is in complete disarray and every day brings some revelation of further incompetence, says John Passant.
    https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/malcolm-turnbulls-democracy-at-work–just-not-next-week,10961
    “Not leadershit again!”, or WTTE, laments the SMH editorial.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/smh-editorial/not-the-leadership-maelstrom-again–20171124-gzsgyz.html
    David Speers writes about what an LNP loss in Queensland will mean for Turnbull and his leadership. Google.
    /news/opinion/queensland-election-holds-more-danger-for-pm-malcolm-turnbull/news-story/f72d5a2a2dcfe964af7c016cbc9ac9dd
    Crispin Hull outs it to us that Turnbull and Cosgrove’s decision to stop parliament shows our democracy is fragile.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/turnbull-and-cosgroves-decision-to-stop-parliament-shows-our-democracy-is-fragile-20171123-gzrul9.html
    Phil Coorey says that the Libs haven’t learned anything from previous leadership struggles. Google.
    http://www.afr.com/news/politics/losing-bennelong-will-be-very-bad-for-malcolm-turnbull-20171123-gzrx32
    “Who’s playing with Turnbull’s head?” asks Jack Waterford. He’s been writing some good stuff lately.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/whos-playing-with-malcolm-turnbulls-head-20171123-gzrux9.html

  24. Section 2 . . .

    Peter van Onselen on PHON and GST being big headaches for the Coalition. Google.
    /news/inquirer/one-nation-is-a-headache-and-gst-is-also-taxing-for-the-coalition/news-story/3c30907a6ff1f67cfd83c6dfe81aebf8
    Peter Hartcher looks back at the Howard and Rudd successes and failures. Worth reading.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/it-would-have-been-devastating-kevin-rudd-reveals-emergency-call-to-george-w-bush-to-avert-gfc-disaster-20171124-gzsh3r.html
    Tony Wright on the deep shadow Pauline Hanson is casting over today’s Queensland election.
    http://www.smh.com.au/queensland/queensland-election/power-struggle-could-pauline-hansons-one-nation-hold-balance-of-power-in-queensland-20171124-gzs73d.html
    ACT Labor players have talked up former NSW premier Kristina Keneally as a potential star candidate for Canberra’s new third federal seat, a plan complicated by her run in the surprise Bennelong by-election.
    http://www.smh.com.au/act-news/act-labor-considered-kristina-keneally-for-new-seat-20171123-gzrbqf.html
    Mike Seccombe says that in the wake of the survey on same-sex marriage, the notion of a silent majority has been disproved and conservative battlelines are being redrawn. The YES vote has changed politics.
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/politics/2017/11/24/how-the-yes-vote-changes-politics/15114848875556
    Peter Hannam says there is still a lot of work to be done on the NEG before the states sign on.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hard-to-overcome-the-impression-that-energy-plan-guarantees-only-more-confusion-20171124-gzs1x9.html
    South Australia has slammed Frydenberg’s “third best proposal”.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/south-australia-slams-thirdbest-option-as-turnbull-government-claims-win-on-energy-policy-20171124-gzs6hu.html
    Victorian Treasurer, Tim Pallas, tells us that it’s simple – the reason gas price is so his is that too much is being sent overseas.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/the-reason-for-rising-gas-prices-is-simple-too-much-is-being-sent-overseas-20171123-gzryz6.html
    Stephen Koukoulas reckons that by this time next year the AUD will be down to USD0.65.
    https://thekouk.com/item/552-watch-out-below-the-aussie-dollar-is-about-to-sink.html
    Federal Court bosses will accept an offer from the industrial umpire to mediate its workplace battle with staff after they emphatically rejected a second pay offer with a landslide ‘no’ vote.
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/national/public-service/federal-court-accepts-fair-work-mediation-after-landslide-no-vote-20171124-gzs5h4.html

  25. Section 3 . . .

    Oscar Pistorious certainly came off second best in this court appeal.
    http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/world/2017/11/24/oscar-pistorius-sentence-increased/
    Micheal West rejoices where a multinational tax shyster has finally been nailed properly by the mainstream media thanks to this brilliant interview this morning by ABC presenter Jon Faine.
    https://www.michaelwest.com.au/interview-gold-as-abc-journo-grills-tax-cheat-airbnb/
    Nassim Khadem explains why the US will never get control of guns, why trickle down economics and Trump’s tax plan won’t work and how Trump’s anti-terrorism border efforts will fail.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/freakonomics-coauthor-steven-levitt-on-why-the-us-will-never-get-rid-of-guns-20171123-gzrkjc.html
    How queers and refugees changed the politics of suicide and self-harm.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/how-queers-and-refugees-changed-the-politics-of-suicide-and-selfharm-20171122-gzqy74.html
    Karen Middleton on the Foreign Affairs white paper.
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/defence/2017/11/25/foreign-policy-depends-us-priorities/15115284005552
    Simon Cowan gives federal opposition parties a word of warning.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/be-careful-what-you-wish-for-opposition-parties-constitutional-crises-help-no-one-20171122-gzr0th.html
    Some small businesses are struggling with NBN issues.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/media-and-marketing/one-phone-between-six-people-confusion-as-small-businesses-struggle-with-nbn-switch-20171122-gzr4ch.html
    Ross Gittins looks ahead to what lies in store for our economy.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/has-spring-sprung-in-the-economic-garden-20171124-gzs1b3.html
    The retail industry is I a tumultuous period.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail/we-are-only-just-getting-started-myer-finishes-round-one-amid-retail-upheaval-20171123-gzrywt.html
    Adele Ferguson writes that hundreds of former Aveo residents have signed up for two separate class actions against the retirement village giant.
    http://www.smh.com.au/business/banking-and-finance/hundreds-sign-up-for-aveo-class-action-20171124-gzscfz.html

  26. Section 4 . . .

    Theresa May still faces a “huge challenge” in persuading the EU to move the Brexit negotiations on to discussions about trade and a transition period in December, the president of the European council, Donald Tusk, has said.
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/24/theresa-may-brussels-brexit-divorce-bill-offer-summit
    Michael Koziol tells us about the last day at the original Manus Island detention centre.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/im-not-sure-what-theyre-going-to-do-with-me-uncertainty-awaits-after-monthlong-manus-island-standoff-ends-20171124-gzs5tf.html
    Martin McKenzie-Murray writes that as the government turns its back, the detention centre on Manus Island is smashed apart and the men there are brutalised.
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/politics/2017/11/25/manus-island-inside-the-brutal-end-game/15115284005557
    Bill Shorten responds to the open letter from several Australians of the Year about Manus Island.
    https://independentaustralia.net/life/life-display/bill-shorten-response-to-letter-from-australians-of-the-year-re-manus-island,10965
    Richard Flanagan writes Australia built a hell for refugees on Manus. The shame will outlive us all.
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/nov/24/the-shame-of-the-evil-being-done-on-manus-will-outlive-us-all
    Malcolm Turnbull is kidding himself if he thinks the Manus crisis is over says Tim Costello.
    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/malcolm-turnbull-is-kidding-himself-if-he-thinks-the-manus-crisis-is-over-20171124-gzs3ru.html
    The Victorian assisted dying bill is a victory of the people over the church, of secular views over dogma, of human rights over religious constraint, and of empirical evidence over fear and doubt.
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/opinion/topic/2017/11/25/the-state-and-the-right-die/15115284005553
    Trump’s former national security adviser, Michael Flynn, may be moving to cooperate with the special counsel investigating ties between the Trump campaign and efforts by Russia to meddle in the 2016 presidential election, The New York Times reported yesterday.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2017/11/23/michael-flynn-may-be-cooperating-with-robert-muellers-russia-probe-report_a_23286808/?utm_hp_ref=au-homepage
    The French president, Emmanuel Macron, is to launch a “cultural war” against sexism and sexual violence with a five-year emergency plan including educating secondary school children about pornography and simplifying the system for rape and assault victims to go to the police.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/24/french-president-emmanuel-macron-launch-cultural-war-on-sexual-abuse

  27. Section 5 . . . Cartoon Corner

    David Rowe takes Turnbull to the cricket.

    Jim Pavlidis with some memories.

    John Shakespeare and a certain vaudeville act.

    Matt Golding with Turnbull’s lead up to Christmas.

    More from Golding.

    Paul Zanetti and today’s election.

    Mark Knight isn’t holding out much hope for the Tullamarine rail link.

    The Trump’s Thanksgiving meal.

    Alan Moir on Labor’s stand on Manus.

    Sean Leahy on Labor’s debt reduction strategy.

    And Leahy gets ready for voting today.

    Mark Cornwall channels the Wizard of Id.

  28. Jaegar

    Something I found interesting about the QLD state election is that pre-poll voting is actively encouraged

    It certainly is. In the ACT it was clear at the last federal election that they like as many voters as possible to pre-poll.

  29. BK

    Peter Hartcher looks back at the Howard and Rudd successes and failures.

    KRudd predictable – ‘blowing his horn’ and then having a huge whinge about others. No thoughts at all that he was the main architect of his downfall.

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